Ute vs SUV

stees

New Member
Hi all, newbie here and new to 4x4ing in general (except for that one vaguely novelty "course" I did for half a day 10 years ago haha). So I'm straight in with being an annoying advice-seeker.. Just sold the sensible sedan and looking to get something to let us go off camping. Just the wife and I + little 2yr old. Basically, I'm wondering what the thoughts are on 4x4 utes vs SUV body - any feelings you have would be great. I know obviously a ute will have firmer springs so will be less comfy for on-road driving. Also, if we end up going ute - it will 100% have a lockable canopy so all our stuff doesn't grow legs. Cheers all! Steve
 

Rusty Panels

Well-Known Member
It totally depends on you. don't go for a ute body unless you have the use for it. I personally don't see any benefit in having a ute and putting a canopy on it. I mean, you've just bought a ute and tried to make a wagon out of it. What's the point? In my opinion if you buy a ute it's because you need a ute. If you put a canopy on a ute you have the problem of always having to climb into the back to retrieve whatever you put in there. A wagon lets you put the groceries or whatever in the back without them ending up all over the place when you drive down the road.
I was going to buy another ute last time but went the wagon because it's more weather friendly and just as capable.
It's a choice you need to make for yourself.
 

Komang

Well-Known Member
Agree with Rusty
I got ute to go out camping and it proposed to use the tub to carry thing in daily activity.
If you need a tub or tray probably ute will be better otherwise suv body which will carry enough stuff for camping at the back too.
 

dabbler

Active Member
Storage and carriage of nastier things like fuels or wet gear is a lot simpler in canopy/tray/tub than inside the cabin.

My impression is utes give more storage space than all but the largest suv bodies. Just an impression though and I guess it will vary from vehicle to vehicle.

If you go suv body, invest in a decent cargo barrier.
 

2luxes

Well-Known Member
I know obviously a ute will have firmer springs so will be less comfy for on-road driving.
They may be much softer than you think. Our old 1991 Hilux is very firm with its leaf springs at both ends and heaps of unsprung weight but our 2003 single cab with independent front suspension is supprisingly smooth. That is both on and off road.

It was three years old and stock standard with no accessories when we bought it. It's LT tyres had 40 psi in them at both ends and the ride felt like it had no springs. The hand book said 25 psi at the front at all times and 25 to 34 rear depending on load. The book also said for the purpose of setting pressures, the car is considered to be empty when it is carrying two people and up to 100 kgs of luggage.

I contacted the tyre manufacturer and was told to use the handbook pressures, do not reduce them when off sealed roads, never exceeded them by more than 4psi and the 4psi rule for setting them is not reliable.

Thirteen years and 160,000 k's later and everywhere from the Sydney Harbor Bridge to tracks in the Victorian High Country to remote tracks through the centre to the middle of the WA deserts, we are still using those pressures and tyre sizes and are enjoying the ride from them and the standard springs.

When looking at utes, take note of the rear springs. Ours have three long curved leaves with two shorter, flat and heavier leaves under them. I used two of them under a trailer based on half a Hilux chassis and the aluminium tray that I took off our ute so I could build a camping body on it. I was amazed at how flexible those three long leaves are. I could place them upside down then stand on them with my little 70 kgs and easily bounce up and down. We have recently moved from a city environment to near the Snowy Mountains and I am going to have fit stiffer shocks on the trailer to reduce sway when full of firewood on bush tracks.

Todays utes are being sold in the thousands as family cars so I would imagine the suspension would have to give a comfortable ride while both empty and full.

We don't have a bull bar on ours. Hanging over forty or more kilos of the front about half a metre in front of the centre of the wheels will have an adverse effect on handling. I read in a NRMA journal recently that the installation kit for the genuine Toyota bull bar for the Hilux includes new front springs. I would imagine they have similar kits for all of their cars that they have designed bull bars for.

That is something to keep in mind if you want one.
 

mikehzz

Well-Known Member
Almost all utes are rear wheel drive with no centre diff, the Triton up spec and the Amarok are the exception. So its 4wd only on loose surfaces, no all wheel drive. Almost all utes don't have rear disk brakes. A Prado or Pajero have both, are more comfortable and just as capable. It's a clear choice unless you really need a ute in my opinion.
 

stees

New Member
Wow, thanks for the replies everyone... definitely helpful. I totally agree with only getting a ute if you need a ute, that was my opinion at the start of all this. Budget is a factor though and I see more modern utes with less Ks for less money than an older Prado. Ultimately, I'd want a reasonably new Prado but again - it's all about cash :(
 

Rusty Panels

Well-Known Member
As I said earlier I'd go the wagon personally unless you need the ute for every day purposes. Most are 4 coil nowadays and more refined comfort and handling. You can also add the Ford Everest to the list of 4 wheel disc brakes. There's only a couple of Utes that have disc brake rears. You can easy chuck a box trailer on if you need to pick up or drop off bulky stuff.
Having said that I do miss my little old Hilux tray back often! :(
If you want the ute and can afford it there will be some good deals on Mazda BT50's shortly as they are advertising a new model. Not a bad vehicle from reports. Some of the finance deals might surprise you too.
 

Rusty Panels

Well-Known Member
They may be much softer than you think. Our old 1991 Hilux is very firm with its leaf springs at both ends and heaps of unsprung weight but our 2003 single cab with independent front suspension is supprisingly smooth. That is both on and off road.

It was three years old and stock standard with no accessories when we bought it. It's LT tyres had 40 psi in them at both ends and the ride felt like it had no springs. The hand book said 25 psi at the front at all times and 25 to 34 rear depending on load. The book also said for the purpose of setting pressures, the car is considered to be empty when it is carrying two people and up to 100 kgs of luggage.

I contacted the tyre manufacturer and was told to use the handbook pressures, do not reduce them when off sealed roads, never exceeded them by more than 4psi and the 4psi rule for setting them is not reliable.

Thirteen years and 160,000 k's later and everywhere from the Sydney Harbor Bridge to tracks in the Victorian High Country to remote tracks through the centre to the middle of the WA deserts, we are still using those pressures and tyre sizes and are enjoying the ride from them and the standard springs.

When looking at utes, take note of the rear springs. Ours have three long curved leaves with two shorter, flat and heavier leaves under them. I used two of them under a trailer based on half a Hilux chassis and the aluminium tray that I took off our ute so I could build a camping body on it. I was amazed at how flexible those three long leaves are. I could place them upside down then stand on them with my little 70 kgs and easily bounce up and down. We have recently moved from a city environment to near the Snowy Mountains and I am going to have fit stiffer shocks on the trailer to reduce sway when full of firewood on bush tracks.

Todays utes are being sold in the thousands as family cars so I would imagine the suspension would have to give a comfortable ride while both empty and full.

We don't have a bull bar on ours. Hanging over forty or more kilos of the front about half a metre in front of the centre of the wheels will have an adverse effect on handling. I read in a NRMA journal recently that the installation kit for the genuine Toyota bull bar for the Hilux includes new front springs. I would imagine they have similar kits for all of their cars that they have designed bull bars for.

That is something to keep in mind if you want one.
I had a 2002 lux with the IFS and a TJM bullbar with standard springs. No adverse effects. Handled fine. Maybe I was lucky.
 

Albynsw

Well-Known Member
If you are going to get better value for money from a ute as in newer less k’s for the cash and you are happy with it for every day use go for it.
I personally much prefer a ute over a wagon for touring, they are so much easier to live out of and carry your gear but it is a personal choice
As I said before both will do what you want it is just a personal preference thing of how you want to go about it
 

FrankP

Active Member
I've had both - A Prado and a BT50. We are just a couple, retired, so no 2yo to consider, but we have found the dual cab BT50 with a tradie canopy is way better for camping/touring. We found we were always shifting stuff around in the Prado, playing Tetris to locate what we needed. With the BT's canopy everything is simply accessible. And the dual cab configuration gives us 5 seats when we need them.

We chose the BT50/Ranger because they have class-leading room in the rear seats. It's a car in front and a truck behind. And it's more than adequately comfortable as a daily drive. Being a 4 door the cabin space would happily serve the needs of you and your little one. You'll need the room in a couple of years when your little one wants friends to camp with or when a sibling arrives. With a wagon I think you'll find the space fills up with people and you'll be hard put to pack what you need for everyone. With a ute, all the stuff goes in the back.

So I reckon the ute.
 

2luxes

Well-Known Member
I had a 2002 lux with the IFS and a TJM bullbar with standard springs. No adverse effects. Handled fine. Maybe I was lucky.
There has to be difference when weight is increased at either end of a car. Toyota would not include different springs without a good reason.

The most noticeable difference that I have seen was on Hiace vans. We had a few customers at work with them and one had a bull bar. It was noticeably heavier in the front out on the road.

One day another one came in with not only a bull bar but a spare wheel on the bar. Talk about a bugger of a thing to drive. It did not like going around corners.
 

smitty_r51

Well-Known Member
I would add the wagon is usually shorter with a better turning circle than the ute equivalent. Can mean it is more manageable around town day to day
 

shanegtr

Well-Known Member
Yes, there is that. The BT50 in a Woolies carpark can be a bitch
The rangers and BT50's are a bloody long car. My old Suburban is a big car, but the rangers and BT50's are only an inch shorter in wheelbase and overall length only 150mm shorter
 

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Gidgee

Active Member
A ute with canopy has way more carrying capacity than a wagon, e.g. DMax vs MUX. You can carry larger, heavier, smelly and dirtier items. The wagon is the go if towing though, as the towbar ends up too far back on the ute, risking a bent chassis on certain tracks.

BTW, according to Alice cops, lockable canopy or wagon matters not, they simply smash windows and pull everything out.
 

cam04

Well-Known Member
Just back from a weekend camping with a mate. I have a ranger, he has a 200 Sahara.
Guess which car gets used for going to cut firewood, running the rubbish out, carrying the chainsaw and fuel, blah blah blah. If you are going to be a ponce in an suv, make sure you camp with a mate who has a Ute, or just buy a Ute. (Tongue in cheek - he’s a good bloke and I like big fires)
 

shanegtr

Well-Known Member
I personally prefer wagons, but I dont really have the option of a ute anyway as I need to pack in too much human cargo:p
 
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