Smoking Banned in NSW National Parks

Aaron Schubert

Moderator
As usual, the tiny minority force silly laws to get passed. I don't think this is the solution, and it will be impossible to police anyway. People just need to be educated and learn a bit more respect

Aaron
 

Eightyeight

Member
The theory is flawed.

If it's a littering problem then we should ban eating food, drinking and babies (nappies) as they are strewn everywhere in outdoor areas.

I'm a smoker, big deal, and I acknowledge some or most litter their butts. That's no different to everything else.

To those whom whine and carry on about the smell; don't camp within touching distance. It's an outdoor area. Furthermore and based on your view; I hate the knobs who yahoo and carry on around busy camps at all hours of the night. So ban drinking. Troll troll troll...


Checkout my ride in My Colorado build Thread!!!
 

slivertoy

Well-Known Member
as a smoker, i think it's a bit over the top, how are they going to enforce it?, is it OK driving in your 4x4 and smoking, using your ashtray, whilst in a NP?,

i too use a empty can or bottle if i'm in the bush or (to my wife's disgust) stub it out and put the butt in my pocket.

can just see it in 5 year's time. outside all the national parks there will be a little booth that smokers can use, before they go into the park, just like the pub's have;)

4x4 driver's will be driving out of the parks, just to have a ciggie, in the booth's at the gates and then driving back to camp......
yeah right:D
 

Jackolux

Well-Known Member
Bloody Smokers don't upset em . I have seen plenty of smokers put their rubbish in the right place but when it comes to Butts that must be different they just drop em .

You don't have to be in their bloody smoke to be annoyed , just yesterday I had to go into the local Vic Roads you know take a number a sit/wait , sat next to a Bloke only seat available couldn't half tell he was a smoker by the smell

. Why don't ya just give em up
 

Blue_haired_man

Well-Known Member
G'day
Just an update, I have emailed my local state member, the premier and the minister for environment. I encourage everyone else who has a problem with this policy to do the same.
National parks are public lands, no one should be restricted from entering them like a criminal because of the actions of wankers


Cheers Leo
 

Blue_haired_man

Well-Known Member
Bloody Smokers don't upset em . I have seen plenty of smokers put their rubbish in the right place but when it comes to Butts that must be different they just drop em .



You don't have to be in their bloody smoke to be annoyed , just yesterday I had to go into the local Vic Roads you know take a number a sit/wait , sat next to a Bloke only seat available couldn't half tell he was a smoker by the smell



. Why don't ya just give em up

Who in the hell gives you the right to tell me to give them up?

I'm sorry you don't like the smell, you are free not to smoke, but last time I checked this is mostly a free country.

You don't know me, what I've been through, or that 73% of men and 53% of women with a mental illness smoke, with 50% of those smoke more than 20 a day. The answers aren't as black and white as you would like to think.


Cheers Leo
 

Eightyeight

Member
Bloody Smokers don't upset em . I have seen plenty of smokers put their rubbish in the right place but when it comes to Butts that must be different they just drop em .



You don't have to be in their bloody smoke to be annoyed , just yesterday I had to go into the local Vic Roads you know take a number a sit/wait , sat next to a Bloke only seat available couldn't half tell he was a smoker by the smell



. Why don't ya just give em up

Based on that logic we should also ban from public places; most hippies / naturalists, most computer nerds, butchers, fast food workers, truckers, tradies, alco's, anyone having just conducted PT, those with a poor level of personal hygiene ect ect cause they can be smelt and it's generally not pleasant. Sorry if I missed your category, flame me later ha ha.


Checkout my ride in My Colorado build Thread!!!
 

03GV

Member
Its great isnt it guy's! They're already being shunned from every public space, soon they'll be doing it illegally in their own homes!;)

Just yesterday stopped at the lights i saw some +×*ker smoking in his car with kids in the back seat!:mad:
 

CatchinJack

Member
Some evidence based research for you to read. Also remember that conditions must be near perfect for a butt to ignite into a fire....


It's enough to make your blood boil - the sight of someone throwing a cigarette butt out of a car window. Every year the Fire & Rescue NSW (FRNSW) is called to hundreds of roadside fires believed to be caused by discarded butts.
FRNSW Station Officer Paul Scott, based at Parramatta Fire Station, has fought many fires on busy roads and even railway tracks where the most likely cause was a dropped cigarette butt. This led him and the Community Risk Management team to develop a proposal for an awareness campaign for smokers along the lines of the high profile NSW Government anti-littering initiative, “Don’t be a tosser”. It was a good idea in theory but the connection between cigarette butts and roadside fires was still only supported by circumstantial evidence.
That was until a recent study by Jennifer Dainer, a student at the University of Technology Sydney (UTS), with help from the FRNSW and CSIRO, provided solid proof. The study, which Ms Dainer undertook as her honours project for her degree in Forensic Science, was co-supervised by Dr Anne Lear from FRNSW Corporate Risk Management and Phil Maynard from UTS.
The study

As part of the study, called Can cigarettes butts start (Bush)fires, Ms Dainer conducted outdoor trials, supervised by Station Officer Scott and three firefighters with a fire engine from Parramatta Fire Station. She lit cigarettes and threw them into grass on the side of a road in the Sydney suburb of Prospect where there was no danger to surrounding property. At the time the prevailing conditions were recorded as wind speed of 40km/h, fuel (grass) moisture content approximately 12% of oven dry weight and humidity 14%.
“On the day it was around 27°C with a north westerly wind, and it was pretty dry,” Station Officer Scott said. In three out of the 75 trials, or 4%, the grass caught alight and started to burn, requiring the firefighters to extinguish the flames.
“The fires would have progressed quite quickly if we hadn’t been there,” says Station Officer Scott. “It’s no wonder we’re called to so many fires on busy roads and freeways and by railway lines when they can start so easily.”
As well as the outdoor trials, the study also involved:

laboratory trials to show whether cigarette butts could ignite grassy fuel (hay) in a well-controlled environment and to identify the parameters which affect ignition potential; and
a survey of the number of cigarette butts on two median strips on a three lane road in Western Sydney.


The laboratory trials found cigarette butts ignited the hay in 33% of cases. Ignitions increased when the wind speed increased, fuel moisture decreased (though wetter fuels could ignite with the application of wind) and the degree of the contact between the fuel bed and combustion area of the cigarette increased.
During the survey, 426 cigarette butts were collected in a 60 square metre area of the median strip of Abbott Road, Seven Hills, over a three-week period. The wind draught created by a line of passing traffic was also recorded and found to be sufficient to increase the potential for a cigarette butt to start a fire on the roadside even if the prevailing conditions were calm.
 

03GV

Member
The way I see it, regardless of needing "supposed" perfect conditions for a butt to ignite your not allowed to have fires on fireban days/season's in NP's. So smoking should be prohibited at those times.
 

Paddler Ed

Well-Known Member
The way I read it was that the bush fire risk was lower down the list; what was higher up the list was the damage both to the environmental aesthetic (litter) and to the fauna who eat it by mistake.

That's the bit that I think is the most important, the idea that this is all about the fire risk is actually a much lower reason for stopping the litter.

The Sydney Morning Herald actually explained it a lot better than the ABC did (for once...) as it also explains the leeching of the chemicals from the butts, and the ingestion of the butts.
 

Swaggie

Moderator
While i don't condone people throwing there butts anywhere but rubbish bins etc ,I think Arsonists are a much bigger concern...
 

ross and cher

New Member
The way I read it was that the bush fire risk was lower down the list; what was higher up the list was the damage both to the environmental aesthetic (litter) and to the fauna who eat it by mistake.

That's the bit that I think is the most important, the idea that this is all about the fire risk is actually a much lower reason for stopping the litter.

The Sydney Morning Herald actually explained it a lot better than the ABC did (for once...) as it also explains the leeching of the chemicals from the butts, and the ingestion of the butts.
Thanks for the link Ed. Regardless of the ranking the end result is the same - those that do the right thing and bin their butts get a smack around the ears because of the grubs that are too lazy or cant think
 

muc the truck

Well-Known Member
Some evidence based research for you to read. Also remember that conditions must be near perfect for a butt to ignite into a fire....
I have stopped and stamped out a small fire on side of the road near bright nsw fire was about 30 cm round at the time but still smouldering , I seen the moron do it at night ahead of me . next servo I see his ute , I had a go at him and he lied his teeth out , next minute he tosses a but down near the bowser. I said I rest my case your a fnkidiot. His butt ignited the ground within the time it took me to catch up to him .

Another time here in Townsville the council road side gardens were set on fire by a cigarette as they had layed mulch down . it burnt along Ingham road all afternoon beside the railway line until it run out of mulch as the fire brigade watched which I found strange that they didn't put it out.

the worst time time I was a kid living near Capella qld . The wheat has been harvested and stubble was dry as a bone . The wheat stubble caught fire and burnt from the road side up to the farm house and though a few farms . There bloody big farms out there with no help at all . we emptied our tanks wetting down lawn around the house .lost the orchid . we were told a smoker was seen tossing a smoke out on the way to emerald .

I am adamant a lot of bush fires are caused by smokers tossing butts out . Used ashtrays in the car devalue there vehicle . I see smokers toss butts out the window every single day here. why would they do any different when they drive between towns in the bush?

The fines need to be crippling then butt tossers will stop
 

Albynsw

Well-Known Member
It seems with smokers that discarding your cigarette but anywhere is acceptable behaviour and they don't view it as littering
I couldn't care less if people smoke or not as long as I am not affected by it but it shits me to see butts everywhere
 

4WDN

4x4 Earth Contributer
It is a bit hard, but it is 2014 if you still smoke..... I don't know how smart or how much control to do the right thing someone that still smokes really has.
I see butts getting dropped out of car windows all the time also,
Campsites littered with butts.
The law wont stop many though, how hard would it be to police.
Its only if a fire starts and gets traced back to somebody and smoking they may get jail time.
 
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