Sand Flags?

steelo

New Member
Wasn't sure just wondered that's all, when you see a flag over the top of a dune it'd affect how far you went to the left wouldn't it? :confused:
 

Quozie

4x4 Earth Contributer
Wasn't sure just wondered that's all, when you see a flag over the top of a dune it'd affect how far you went to the left wouldn't it? :confused:
I would have thought Passenger so you can't get done for obscuring your vision, Beach/Sand still has road rule, "just my thought"
 

Quozie

4x4 Earth Contributer
forgive my ignorance/noobness...

sand flags??

LOL............. Sand Flags are use particularly, but not limited to Dune driving, It allows vehicles on the opposite side to view oncoming traffic, Handy on the beach around camping sites etc or outback where dunes are steep.
 

millsy

4x4 Earth Contributer
forgive my ignorance/noobness...

sand flags??

A sand flag is usually a red flag that is flown from the top of a tall fibreglass mast, usually mounted on the bullbar, but sometiimes from the front of the roof rack. They are used in hilly terrain, such as sand hill country, to prevent a head on collision if two cars reach the summit of a 'blind crest' at the same time on a one lane track.

But can anyone tell me why people mount them vertically. Wouldn't they give a better view 'over the hill' if they had a forward lean on them. Maybe about 15 or 20 degrees. I suppose it should match the gradient of the average steep sand hill, whatever that is.
 

pheoninx

New Member
ha ha cheers.. i thought that might have been it, but my mind ran away and i started making things up as to what they could be for...

fail.. ha ha
 

Davidman

5th Annual Victorian Gathering member
Your making some sense there with the angles Millsy. Makes a lot of sense. :):)
 

millsy

4x4 Earth Contributer
There's probably something very obvious that we've overlooked!

When you think about it, how often have you come to a crest where the angle is so steep that you are leaning back in your seat, the front of the bonnet is up level with your eyeballs, and all you see is sky, let alone which way the track might turn over the crest, or any oncoming traffic! So that's even more reason for a sand flag to lean forward.
 
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steelo

New Member
You probably would have to take them off everytime you got to a road/track, & when driving through the odd bit of scrub around beach/dune area's it would stick in them. But good thought though, thanks guys. :D

Quozie how was the trip? am going out locally this a.m. to compare the old Explorer against the new (old) Patrol, probably in the Eli area 1st, interested? call me.
 

teza h

Well-Known Member
Hi Steelo,glad you open'd this thred. Millsy, what about going down hills? I think a vertically mounted is better than no flag at all. Dont know about SA but I havent seen any one using sand flags around here for years,I flew one at Stockton beech-dunes and i was the only one out of heaps of people there doing it.
Got some looks to. I us my long beach fishing rod as a mast and you can eazely make a flag out of a hi vis
vest or t shert. They do stop stacks and may be save a life.

To all you dune drivers in NSW and QLD,,,, GET A FLAG !!!!
 

billolga

Well-Known Member
Stockton Beach is an open area & you can USUALLY see other vehicles around. The problem is on single lane tracks like in the Simpson - Googes Track - Vic/ SA Border Track etc.

I use a flag in scrubby areas as well, like the Holland track in WA where you can have a possible head on.:eek:
 

steelo

New Member
I've had mine mounted on the passenger side before which means you'd have to have a 2 car + width "minimum" when cresting any dunes. :D
 

millsy

4x4 Earth Contributer
Hi Steelo,glad you open'd this thred. Millsy, what about going down hills? I think a vertically mounted is better than no flag at all.

Yes, I think I see what you are getting at. It would be not a problem on the way down, but if there is a sudden leveling off at the bottom then the top of the flag would be closer to the level ground than normal, when the car's front wheels have not yet reached the level ground. But I don't think that would occur very often in nature.

The only time you would get such a quick change in angle would be at the bottom of a hard rocky track going into a sandy creek maybe, and chances are you would not be flying a flag anyway in those situations. But if you are you would need to be careful you don't poke your flag into the car in front. But if you did you were probably driving a lot closer than normal safe separation anyway.

Sand hills have a more gentle curve at the bottom of a hill due to erosion of the sand down hill. Any sudden V shape would be filled in by sand due to gravitational, wind and rain effects.

I would be interested in knowing if anyone on the forum has actually crested a hill at the same time as another vehicle coming in the opposite direction. If by some fluke this has happened to them, and the other vehicle was actually flying a flag, did they see it in time to hit the brakes? This is a bit different to seeing a flag come over a crest when you are still 10 metres or more from the other vehicle. Since you are not near the top you do not have your bonnet obstructing your view. The flag(s) are really only of any use when both cars arrive at the top at the same time, otherwise its just another accessory the shops are flogging to improve their profits.

So, has it really been a crash preventer for anyone on this forum?

Don't get me wrong now. I have never had a grudge against sand flags, or 4x4 shops, but this thread has just got me thinking about the geometry of it all.
 
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BILLBY

New Member
flags

like the lean idea ,how about a flag with a camera / video mounted on top. Few of the dunes we have traveled over I would have liked to know what was coming :cool:
If it hasn't been done yet you read it here first lol:D:D
 

billolga

Well-Known Member
like the lean idea ,how about a flag with a camera / video mounted on top. Few of the dunes we have traveled over I would have liked to know what was coming :cool:
If it hasn't been done yet you read it here first lol:D:D

Good one 1firefighter63
Leaning Flags- Left or right side - Video Camera's :rolleyes: It's a WORRY:cool:
 

Chard

4x4 Earth Contributer
Millsy, Having a flag on a ten degree angle might get hung up in overhanging trees a bit like a jousting stick I reckon. I have seen it before though.
Teza, Every time I head out where I am expecting traffic I will stick it up. Better than wishing you did after you end up with a bikie on your bonnet.
Steelo, I have mine mounted in the centre as there seems to be less trees to hit.

Lets have safe fun in the dunes and they wont shut them down.
 

steelo

New Member
Seems like that could be a spot to use, but any hassles from the law due to vision obstruction, as you (I) can't always store it in /on our 4b's between beach/dune sites.

Only started this to see if there was a recognized side but it seems not, maybe its something that the 4wd associations should look into :confused: :D
 

Jacked Surf

Member
Millsy i have had my sandflag save two people on the border track.

but not other cars..

Two motorbikes travelling along through the tracks.

I was driving south, they were going north. (not in the one-way section).

I run a 3m fiberglass blackwidow flag kit, so they saw the flag coming over the hill and got out the way off the track.

Its not only for 4wds but for the other users of the area we are most likely to kill if they dont see us.

Its along way to the hospital out there and the two-wheeled variety most likely wouldn't survive the trip to the hospital let alone to "signal range" if you collide with them on the track..

Its alot easier to see a bright orange flag in the middle of the bush then a dark 4x4 going through scrub.

For that reason alone i swear by them.

Steelo, i run mine as close to the centre of the vehicle as i can. not saying thats the correct way but that way most people steer clear a car width either side.
 
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