BillyGoat app project reveal

4x4 Earth Black Friday Sale

Albynsw

Well-Known Member
It’s a shame to see so much bad will among mud map customers. I bought a majority share in Equibs solutions P/L (mud map) and as new management, I see this as my responsibility and have the desire to make things right.

First of all, I want to apologise for launching BillyGoat before in this way. I now understand how the promotion must have looked from the perspective of mud map customers. I’m glad you guys have raised these issues as it gives us an opportunity to address them.

What would you guys suggest as a way forward?
Mate it is pretty hard to find a way forward with the history you have. There are others in the market that in it for the long haul and they don’t treat their clientele the way you have.
Personally I have trouble believing that you would not have been aware of the bad blood surrounding this company before making an investment
 

boobook

Well-Known Member
Ryan, you started this post with commentary that you have been working on Software for years and started this project. Not a peep about Mud Map. But there is a lot more to the story, and lots of customers who have been burned more than once by Mud Map.

Yet the truth comes out through one member's ( Cyberess) research that you are Mud Map. You were sprung before fessing up.

For you to be taken seriously I think you need to get a lot of credibility back. If you did buy Mudmap, surely you did the due diligence and know the multiple complaints over many years. They are all over forums, the Mud Map web site, and reviews on Play and the apple store ( that someone recently took down)
Perhaps answering these questions can help potential costomer's understand your situation

Were you part of Mud Map in any way previously?
Does the previous owner have any equity or say in the business?
What relationship do you have with the previous owner?
Why is the company still registered at Austposts head office where the previous owner works?
What is the difference between Mud Map and the product you say is new?
What will the Upgrade path and pricing model?
Are Ryan Hampton and Li Xia the same person?
Your vimeo page says you rely on Mudmap., and web sites like this say the product is by Mudmap. https://appadvice.com/app/billy-goat/1444499634

If you genuinely did buy the business with no knowledge of the history, I wish you the best of luck, I'm no lawyer, but generally when a company is sold the business owes people money, not the previous owner. Prepare for a barrage of refunds or complaints.

The market does need a new, fresh map. Not on Open Street Maps though for god's sake, that has been overdone and is useless in remote areas. Charging for a repackaging of a free, unreliable map is not a great product for customers.

Good luck if you are genuine. I can't help thinking you are disingenuous though based on your posts and the facts.

Just take a look at your first post below.

1)You mention every brand of Commercial GPS mapping except one. Seriously? You never tried Mud Map but bought the company?
2)You are going to introduce IOS first then Android. Coincidently the same as Mud Map version 3
3)You say you want to make it free to use. But on the Appstore, it is listed as $27.49 every 6 months. The publish dates of 'Free' here, and 'not free' on apple are within 30 days of each other. Which is right?

It's not looking good. Buyer beware as they say.


Over the years, I've used most GPS products, inc ozi on a laptop, a few Garmins, and hema, memory map on the ipad more recently. They all have their strengths and weaknesses in terms of mapping support and features. e.g. ozi is really powerful but has a steep learning curve, where as garmins are easy to use but lack mapping.

I'm a software engineer by trade so I decided to start my own part-time project on ios back in 2015. Its now at a stage where major features are in place. Once its fully baked, my intention is to release it as free to use so its widely accessible to everyone. Assuming the community likes it, I will consider an Android resease as well SNIP
Edit ..Ryan, not Richard.
 
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coolumbla

Well-Known Member
Lol
My first thought back in the first post was it sounded like mudmap. Especially after the app wasn’t on the apppstore
I also lost money but then just moved to Hema
And don’t start me on vms

I won’t be buying billygoat
 

Swaggie

Moderator
Lol
My first thought back in the first post was it sounded like mudmap. Especially after the app wasn’t on the apppstore
I also lost money but then just moved to Hema
And don’t start me on vms

I won’t be buying billygoat
Funny that I've bought this up in the past and was told there's nothing wrong with the app and there backup is great, what issues did you have...

Sorry I guess I'm getting you started lol
 

coolumbla

Well-Known Member
Swaggie
I ended up with 2 of them somehow via 4wd action promos (or whatever it was back in the day)
From the point of view of accuracy I found mine to be about 10 m off accurate
The charging pin kept breaking and I had lots of issues with updates
I think the fact that the whole thing wiped itself the night before a trip and back then updates were sent by snail mail on a card didn’t help my impressions

Life may be different now of course

I’ll stick with my Hema Explorer app on my iPad

Oh and did I mention my paper maps?

Shane
 

boobook

Well-Known Member
Does anyone know where Rhampton got to? I notice recent updates to the Billy Goat app pages.

Did he ever address the issues with users that he promised?
 

Julian Myers

New Member
As a fellow Dissatisfied Mud Maps Customer also onto my third version currently MM3, are we going to be hung out to dry with the next IOS Update?????????????
I think I already know the answer...
It is such a shame, as it could of been such a great product.
 

boobook

Well-Known Member
Looks like Mr Innocent RHampton is up to the same tricks as Li Xia at Mudmap. Funny about that.

Take a look at the terms of service.

http://help.billygoatapp.com.au/support/solutions/articles/44001119735-terms-of-service

So if you post tracks or data on the website, not only do you hand over perpetual rights for Equibs to use it, but you then need permission to use your data from Equibs, and they can sue you if someone takes action on them for using it. They can even resell your posted content but you get no fees and are still responsible for any legal issues.

Shees, does this guy have any lower limit on morals? You'd be a moron to sign up to T&C like that. Assuming you'd read them of course.

............................................................................................................
8.8 You agree that you are solely responsible for (and that EQUIBS has no responsibility to you or to any third party for) any Content that you create, transmit or display while using the Services and for the consequences of your actions (including any loss or damage which EQUIBS may suffer) by doing so.

9. PROPRIETARY RIGHTS

9.1 You acknowledge and agree that EQUIBS (or EQUIBS’s licensors) own all legal right, title and interest in and to the Services, including any intellectual property rights which subsist in the Services (whether those rights happen to be registered or not, and wherever in the world those rights may exist). You further acknowledge that the Services may contain information which is designated confidential by EQUIBS and that you shall not disclose such information without EQUIBS’s prior written consent.

...

11.1 You retain copyright and any other rights you already hold in Content which you submit, post or display on or through, the Services. By submitting, posting or displaying the content you give EQUIBS a perpetual, irrevocable, worldwide, royalty-free, and non-exclusive licence to reproduce, adapt, modify, translate, publish, publicly perform, publicly display and distribute any Content which you submit, post or display on or through, the Services. This licence is for the sole purpose of enabling EQUIBS to display, distribute and promote the Services and may be revoked for certain Services as defined in the Additional Terms of those Services.

11.2 You agree that this licence includes a right for EQUIBS to make such Content available to other companies, organizations or individuals with whom EQUIBS has relationships for the provision of syndicated services, and to use such Content in connection with the provision of those services.
 

Albynsw

Well-Known Member
I kind of get where he is coming from but the lawyer has made it sound worse.
Isn’t he basically saying that any information you upload is free to him, he can use that info elsewhere and he is not liable for the accuracy of the information?
 

dno67

Well-Known Member
I kind of get where he is coming from but the lawyer has made it sound worse.
Isn’t he basically saying that any information you upload is free to him, he can use that info elsewhere and he is not liable for the accuracy of the information?
Sounds grubby, if you were to add the same or similar additional info in a trip report or magazine article ? Are they going to have a crack at suing you ? Claiming they put the info out first ?
Lets face it, there's really no last frontier anymore and to a certain extent where
all recycling whats already been done. Unless it's track or road condition updates
and IMO that's what would be of great value to a map source.
Seems there's been a lot go on with this mob behind the scenes, and none of it
appears to have been to the benefit of subscriber.
Walks like duck ?
Quacks like a duck ?
Yep, It's a duck.!
 
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boobook

Well-Known Member
I kind of get where he is coming from but the lawyer has made it sound worse.
Isn’t he basically saying that any information you upload is free to him, he can use that info elsewhere and he is not liable for the accuracy of the information?
Alby,

Section 8.8 says that if you post something, you are solely responsible for your uploaded content, and any loss or damage that Equips may suffer by using it, including selling it.

Eg if you upload a track, and Equip sell it to a third party, and something bad happens ( like the track is wrong and an accident occurs ). Then Equibs can recover all costs from you. You agree that Equibs has no responsibility to you or the third party. EVEN THOUGH you never contemplated the information being used or distributed by Equibs when you posted a track etc.

8.8 You agree that you are solely responsible for (and that EQUIBS has no responsibility to you or to any third party for) any Content that you create, transmit or display while using the Services and for the consequences of your actions (including any loss or damage which EQUIBS may suffer) by doing so.

In other words, you are liable for any consequences of your data being used or distributed if there is a law suit.. Equibs gets the money and you signed away their responsibility.

That isn't normal or fair.
 

Albynsw

Well-Known Member
I am not trying to stick up for this mob because they do sound dodgy but what is the go with say a forum where a third party posts the information on say a track or route, is the forum liable for the information because they are the platform it was published on?

Just on the rights, it is common practice when you have an article done on say your house or car etc that you assign the rights of that information to the publisher for their reuse elsewhere as they see fit and often that you do not make the item available for a similar article from their competitors
 

Choook

Well-Known Member
Ah, the old details in the fine print trick. (in Maxwell Smart voice)

These sort of T&C's are common these days with almost any online entity. All care no resposibility.
Those that use Facebook, have you actually read the T&C's. That is why I rarely if ever post my own photos to that media. They have a similar clause that says something along the lines of, they own it and can do basicly whatever the hell they want with it, including repost, distribute, sell, etc and you have no come back. At least this one says you retain copyright.

As someone posted somewhere once,... reading the EULA or T&C's is like arguing with a woman, in the end you just hit agree.
 

boobook

Well-Known Member
True Chook, the difference here is that you agree to be responsible for the content that they distribute, even if it is without your knowledge. Take a look at the Hema T&C as a contrast. They are fairer. They say they are not responsible for the data if it is lost, and as a user, you can't hold them or the original data provider responsible. So it is safe to post tracks except if their database crashes. you have to provide your own backup copies. But no third party or Hema can sue you for the content.

Besides, isn't this supposed to be a guy doing it as a hobby according to his OP?
 
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